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Post by snerdley on Apr 21, 2008 12:54:02 GMT -6
No. And remember, for the sake of the students in this district, let's keep this a spin-free zone... please.The PSAE will be taken this week at NVHS - I'm not sure about WVHS - maybe someone else knows. The ISAT (middle school and elementary) were taken a month or so ago I believe. So no 2008 test scores are known at this point to know if progress has been made from the already published 07 results. Listen folks, we're talking about children here - let's be factual. Yikes, so nasty! Sorry, I forgot about the PSAE. Was just thinking about the ISATS we took a month ago and thought, yes, the tests that will show our AYP have already been taken. Wasn't trying to spin anything! Geesh! Not nasty at all. I'm just not going to sit quitely while someone spins anything due to the nature of this topic. If you weren't doing that, my apologies. We're talking high school scores here - so that would be the PSAE, which hasn't been taken in 2008 yet. And I'll add this question to my list of others: When were the test results from 2007 received by the district? Did that coincide with the abrupt departure from the effort to secure BB? Edit: In other words, did they bail on BB when they received the 2007 test results that showed WVHS did not make AYP again? |
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Post by d204mom on Apr 21, 2008 12:55:37 GMT -6
Wow what Sleepless In Npvl wrote on the green board "I'm very sad today. I went over to the Blue Board. (now nicknamed the Conspiracy Board) and started reading in their thread about this topic. What started out as progressive banter and concern over this problem progressed into a giant conspiracy theory about how the board is rushing to open MV so they can look better in the eyes of NCLB. I had thought there was a spark for some intelligent conversations regarding this issue, but I guess I was wrong." Very true. I am sad. Look at the beginning of this thread and how everyone was truly concerned about WV's scores and there was a sense that people wanted to find out the reason and work together to solve it. Those posts progressively changed as the thread went on. Just my opinion. Looking for a way to see if these boards can be a constructive solution to problems. But, no, I just see more fingerpointing. ETA: Thanks for the comment, snerdley. Let's stick to facts and suggestions and stop the fingerpointing. Sleepless, C'mon do I have to post Metzger's infamous albatross speech again? About how the boundaries would be unfavorable if they chose a cheaper site (Macom or Hamman) for the high school? Now we see that they would be unfavorable to NCLB subgroups not making AYP. And I love the new nickname from the "Eola or bust" board!  At least the new label doesn't start with an E or an R! |
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Post by sleeplessinnpvl on Apr 21, 2008 12:58:47 GMT -6
Very true. I am sad. Look at the beginning of this thread and how everyone was truly concerned about WV's scores and there was a sense that people wanted to find out the reason and work together to solve it. Those posts progressively changed as the thread went on. Just my opinion. Looking for a way to see if these boards can be a constructive solution to problems. But, no, I just see more fingerpointing. ETA: Thanks for the comment, snerdley. Let's stick to facts and suggestions and stop the fingerpointing. If the SB is using social engineering to avoid taking responsibility for the academic problems, that is reprehensible. And it wouldn't help the students. That's what we're wondering here, Sleepless. Wouldn't you agree that if this is what happened, it would be wrong? Yes it would be terrible. I wonder if our test scores would have improved if we could have gotten BB and started to build the school right away. How much time and energy has been taken away from this board because they have had to deal with all of this in the last two years. No wonder there is such a rush to get this built. The SB has other things on their plates besides boundaries and citizen lawsuits. In my opinion, the needs of the parents are coming before the needs of the children. |
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Post by twhl on Apr 21, 2008 13:08:34 GMT -6
If the SB is using social engineering to avoid taking responsibility for the academic problems, that is reprehensible. And it wouldn't help the students. That's what we're wondering here, Sleepless. Wouldn't you agree that if this is what happened, it would be wrong? Yes it would be terrible. I wonder if our test scores would have improved if we could have gotten BB and started to build the school right away. How much time and energy has been taken away from this board because they have had to deal with all of this in the last two years. No wonder there is such a rush to get this built. The SB has other things on their plates besides boundaries and citizen lawsuits. In my opinion, the needs of the parents are coming before the needs of the children. Much of what they have done lies in executive session until they make a mistake and then it comes out. I also don't recall any parents calling WV the "Albatross". If they didn't bumble so many things, there wouldn't be the mad fever to build just to build. When will you admit the SB has brought most of this on themselves. They in fact have waisted our time. So Sleepless please list the things on their plate that they have accomplished the last couple of years - spin em any way you want. Im sorta struggling myself - call it finger point but if the glove fits. |
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Post by Arch on Apr 21, 2008 13:09:29 GMT -6
If the SB is using social engineering to avoid taking responsibility for the academic problems, that is reprehensible. And it wouldn't help the students. That's what we're wondering here, Sleepless. Wouldn't you agree that if this is what happened, it would be wrong? Yes it would be terrible. I wonder if our test scores would have improved if we could have gotten BB and started to build the school right away. How much time and energy has been taken away from this board because they have had to deal with all of this in the last two years. No wonder there is such a rush to get this built. The SB has other things on their plates besides boundaries and citizen lawsuits. In my opinion, the needs of the parents are coming before the needs of the children. But, Boundaries and Lawsuits have only been a past 2 month thing. That's less than 10% of the time the past 2 years. What about the other 90%+ of the time? eta: grammar policing myself. |
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Post by jftb on Apr 21, 2008 13:10:19 GMT -6
Yikes, so nasty! Sorry, I forgot about the PSAE. Was just thinking about the ISATS we took a month ago and thought, yes, the tests that will show our AYP have already been taken. Wasn't trying to spin anything! Geesh! Not nasty at all. I'm just not going to sit quitely while someone spins anything due to the nature of this topic. If you weren't doing that, my apologies. We're talking high school scores here - so that would be the PSAE, which hasn't been taken in 2008 yet. And I'll add this question to my list of others: When were the test results from 2007 received by the district? Did that coincide with the abrupt departure from the effort to secure BB? Edit: In other words, did they bail on BB when they received the 2007 test results that showed WVHS did not make AYP again? I think that the boundaries have always been based on balancing achievement...didn't the SB say so? Snerdley, what's the score difference at WV with MV at BB or MV at Eola? Just asking if you know; I don't. |
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Post by sleeplessinnpvl on Apr 21, 2008 13:15:20 GMT -6
Yes it would be terrible. I wonder if our test scores would have improved if we could have gotten BB and started to build the school right away. How much time and energy has been taken away from this board because they have had to deal with all of this in the last two years. No wonder there is such a rush to get this built. The SB has other things on their plates besides boundaries and citizen lawsuits. In my opinion, the needs of the parents are coming before the needs of the children. But, Boundaries and Lawsuits have only been a past 2 month thing. That's less than 10% of the time the past 2 years. What about the other 90%+ of the time? eta: grammar policing myself. I disagree. Boundaries since 2005/06.Then trying to find another site after the jury verdict. Oh wait, some people claiming 'bait and switch' say that occurred pre-ref too. I am not trying to defend these guys or say they are doing a fantastic job. They are not. They need help in several areas. But a normal SB would not have to deal with all this. They would publish the boundaries and move onto the next item on their to-do list. |
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Post by Arch on Apr 21, 2008 13:18:19 GMT -6
But, Boundaries and Lawsuits have only been a past 2 month thing. That's less than 10% of the time the past 2 years. What about the other 90%+ of the time? eta: grammar policing myself. I disagree. Boundaries since 2005/06.Then trying to find another site after the jury verdict. Oh wait, some people claiming 'bait and switch' say that occurred pre-ref too. I am not trying to defend these guys or say they are doing a fantastic job. They are not. They need help in several areas. But a normal SB would not have to deal with all this. They would publish the boundaries and move onto the next item on their to-do list. Boundaries were decided before the 2006 vote. Since that meeting, locking in 5A, they were DONE. They only came back into play (according to the timeline of the District) from Mid/end January (site selection) until Mid February (approval of the boundaries)... then DONE again for at least the past 2 months. Are you implying they were working on these boundaries the past 2 years WHILE we were condemning the BB land and moving forward with that trial?  ? That would track with the 4/07 date we saw on a site plan... Things that make you go Hmm... I was born at night... but not last night. |
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Post by d204mom on Apr 21, 2008 13:24:41 GMT -6
Question for all you attorneys out there. "The school board" is named on the BB and NSFOC lawsuit. If a SB member resigns between now and when the trial (or discovery) starts, does that excuse the sb member from testifying or deposition? Or can they sopena anyone they feel has relevant information?
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Post by sleeplessinnpvl on Apr 21, 2008 13:30:22 GMT -6
I disagree. Boundaries since 2005/06.Then trying to find another site after the jury verdict. Oh wait, some people claiming 'bait and switch' say that occurred pre-ref too. I am not trying to defend these guys or say they are doing a fantastic job. They are not. They need help in several areas. But a normal SB would not have to deal with all this. They would publish the boundaries and move onto the next item on their to-do list. Boundaries were decided before the 2006 vote. Since that meeting, locking in 5A, they were DONE. They only came back into play (according to the timeline of the District) from Mid/end January (site selection) until Mid February (approval of the boundaries)... then DONE again for at least the past 2 months. Are you implying they were working on these boundaries the past 2 years WHILE we were condemning the BB land and moving forward with that trial? ? That would track with the 4/07 date we saw on a site plan... Things that make you go Hmm... I was born at night... but not last night. No....arch, shame on you of all people for making assumptions on my posts and shouting conspiracy. That is so unlike you.  All I said was they have had, in the last two years, several non-normal things to deal with that have taken away their focus. Little things, here and there, like making up 17 different boundary plans in order to make people happy. Then, having to go back to square one when the jury verdict came in. Now, having to deal with the loss again of the MWG pull out and subsequent AME purchase. Now, lawsuit after lawsuit. I just see the kids taking a back burner to this. Is it the parents's fault? No. Is it the SB's fault? No. Fate has dealt us some crummy cards. But one has to wonder how all of this plays into their ability to focus on the kids 100% right now. |
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Post by snerdley on Apr 21, 2008 13:30:34 GMT -6
Not nasty at all. I'm just not going to sit quitely while someone spins anything due to the nature of this topic. If you weren't doing that, my apologies. We're talking high school scores here - so that would be the PSAE, which hasn't been taken in 2008 yet. And I'll add this question to my list of others: When were the test results from 2007 received by the district? Did that coincide with the abrupt departure from the effort to secure BB? Edit: In other words, did they bail on BB when they received the 2007 test results that showed WVHS did not make AYP again? I think that the boundaries have always been based on balancing achievement...didn't the SB say so? Snerdley, what's the score difference at WV with MV at BB or MV at Eola? Just asking if you know; I don't. If balancing achievement means shuffling kids to avoid federal and state sanctioned responsibility for academic progress, then I'm wondering if that's legal - especially since there is a racial component to it. And no, I don't know the difference at WV with MV at BB or MV at Eola other than the list of Title 1 schools that Doc posted. What we don't know (and maybe it's available to us regular citizens or maybe it will have to be FOIA'ed) is what are the minority breakdowns performance wise at WV with MV at BB and MV at Eola. That's really the crucial question. Did they manipulate this to "fix" WVHS in 2009? Let's review what happens if a school misses AYP for 6 years: Regional Superintendent removes local school board OR . State Superintedent appoints an Independent Authority to operate school or district . State Board non-recognizes school or district, dissolving the entity OR . State Superintendent reassigns pupils and reassigns or removes administrative staff. These are pretty stiff consequences. Do they drive the SB's decisions? Maybe not, but I would like more information. It all really makes sense. |
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Post by steckmom on Apr 21, 2008 13:31:44 GMT -6
Yikes, so nasty! Sorry, I forgot about the PSAE. Was just thinking about the ISATS we took a month ago and thought, yes, the tests that will show our AYP have already been taken. Wasn't trying to spin anything! Geesh! Not nasty at all. I'm just not going to sit quitely while someone spins anything due to the nature of this topic. If you weren't doing that, my apologies. We're talking high school scores here - so that would be the PSAE, which hasn't been taken in 2008 yet. And I'll add this question to my list of others: When were the test results from 2007 received by the district? Did that coincide with the abrupt departure from the effort to secure BB? Edit: In other words, did they bail on BB when they received the 2007 test results that showed WVHS did not make AYP again? Eep! I only asked the question because I was trying to figure out if the sixth year would be with the schools as they are now. |
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Post by sleeplessinnpvl on Apr 21, 2008 13:36:33 GMT -6
Why would those test results cause the SB to depart from BB?
I'm pretty sure the achievement gap is smaller at BB than AME. IIRC, the Title 1 schools were better split with the BB plan than the AME plan. If they are so worried about test scores, why aren't they persuing BB?
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Post by rew on Apr 21, 2008 13:42:19 GMT -6
Good question, if the Title 1 schools are more balanced, achievement is more balanced, lawsuits go away, construction could have started six months ago...
WHY DID THEY LEAVE BB?
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Post by jftb on Apr 21, 2008 13:42:41 GMT -6
Another thing I'm wondering about is the future of NCLB. If a Democrat takes the White House this fall, will the whole plan be scrapped?
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At least the new label doesn't start with an E or an R!
?