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Post by rew on Apr 27, 2009 17:35:37 GMT -6
WOW, treehugger, maybe you should change your name to McBridehugger! That's quite a resounding endorsement for someone who's been on the job less than a year.
I will hold my judgement and wait for more results. I will say he seems to like a lot of rules, and I would bet if you asked the current Wildcats to vote between him and Dr Popp, Popp would win in a landslide.
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Post by treehugger on Apr 27, 2009 18:24:05 GMT -6
I realize alot of the kids don't care for his strict policies. I have heard some parents complain about these policies as well. I think his qualifications as an educator speak for themselves.
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Post by steckdad on Apr 27, 2009 20:58:18 GMT -6
Thanks DW, I don't think I will ever understand this district. I do know that the "word on the street" I've heard is that NVHS is not comparing well to NCHS and NNHS, and that buyers are requesting "east" in Naperville?? I have friends that are realtors - that has always been true ( If I could physically move my home 300 - 350 feet east to the other side of Plainfield-Naper road- I would tack $125K onto the value and my daughter old be a walker to High School vs. a world traveler if she had gone to MVHS. ) - and the excuse given by our admin that you can remove the bottom 5% @ a certain school and it compares favorably no longer works either. Naperville North socioeconomically falls between NV and WV ( closer to WV) and beats the pants off both. That should not be true - we are no longer the new and growing community we were either- another excuse gone. so this new 'best practice' if it works is being done to compete with NC and NN ? Word has it there will be future plans for WV and MV also - this 'best practices' is a response to NV failing AYP. based on the school report cards, socially I have to disagree. economically WV and NN are similar. but WV is 23% black/hispanic where NN is at 9%. NN is very similar to NV socially. Those two schools have only a margin of 1.3% on the ACT. to compare WV to NN is a stretch IMO. |
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Post by entitled on Apr 27, 2009 21:07:56 GMT -6
It is not a stretch when socio-economics (number of low income students) is factored as opposed to race/nationality (your approach).
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Post by Arch on Apr 27, 2009 22:02:58 GMT -6
Misdirection 101: Redefine someone's statement to be something it wasn't then say it's not valid.
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Post by doctorwho on Apr 27, 2009 22:38:37 GMT -6
I have friends that are realtors - that has always been true ( If I could physically move my home 300 - 350 feet east to the other side of Plainfield-Naper road- I would tack $125K onto the value and my daughter old be a walker to High School vs. a world traveler if she had gone to MVHS. ) - and the excuse given by our admin that you can remove the bottom 5% @ a certain school and it compares favorably no longer works either. Naperville North socioeconomically falls between NV and WV ( closer to WV) and beats the pants off both. That should not be true - we are no longer the new and growing community we were either- another excuse gone. so this new 'best practice' if it works is being done to compete with NC and NN ? Word has it there will be future plans for WV and MV also - this 'best practices' is a response to NV failing AYP. based on the school report cards, socially I have to disagree. economically WV and NN are similar. but WV is 23% black/hispanic where NN is at 9%. NN is very similar to NV socially. Those two schools have only a margin of 1.3% on the ACT. to compare WV to NN is a stretch IMO. so YOU have decided to make it something other than socioeconomics - your call, I choose not to look at it that way. To compare NN and NV socially is based on what ? - % Low income ? -- can't be Neuqua Valley 1.9% Naper Central 4.3% Naper North 8.5% Waubonsie 8.8% Language proficiency issue ? can't be this either Naper Central 0% Neuqua Valley 0.6% Waubonsie 2.6% Naper North 3.1% So again - the comparison is where ?? Sorry but it's Naper north and Waubonsie and North has a HIGHER % of language proficiency issue -- so please re-explain your position again since it is not low income % and it is not language proficiency - I'm not sure I'm understanding you. --------------------------------------------------- oh and a difference of 1.3 points is not 1.3% since the max score is not 100%. But the real comparsion as easily shown here is 25.4 and 22.5 NN is 13% higher - why ? the issue is why does 203 have so much higher a % of kids exceeding state exam levels ? not just meet & exceed -- Meet & Exceed Waubonsie 63.2 meets + 17.0 exceeds Neuqua 76.7 meet + 21.6 exceeds North 77.4 meets + 26.6 exceeds Central 79.7 meets + 28.3 exceeds and his same pattern starts after 3rd grade scores in ISATs- up until then 204 & 203 basically equal. What happens curriculum wise ? |
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Post by doctorwho on Apr 27, 2009 23:07:58 GMT -6
It is not a stretch when socio-economics (number of low income students) is factored as opposed to race/nationality (your approach). or language proficiency issues - North has the highest % gee, it couldn't be the curriculum could it ? Or the fact the admin admits offerings @ NV are more college prep based- and grading tougher- but they will fix by 2012. I was stunned when I heard this admitted to last month at the MVHS meeting - as were most there I believe. naw, must be something else. |
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Post by Arch on Apr 27, 2009 23:32:48 GMT -6
Steckdad,
What made you zero in on Black/Hispanic for a comparison?
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Post by kidsfirst on Apr 28, 2009 5:56:34 GMT -6
I thought Jim Schmid just clarified this in an email posted in this thread earlier and said there are not more college prep classes at NV. Has anyone ever compared the two curriculums?
ETA: I just looked at my course catalog and it is the same catalog for all three schools.
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Post by doctorwho on Apr 28, 2009 6:57:06 GMT -6
I thought Jim Schmid just clarified this in an email posted in this thread earlier and said there are not more college prep classes at NV. Has anyone ever compared the two curriculums? ETA: I just looked at my course catalog and it is the same catalog for all three schools. Maybe you should ask him then - because he is the one that admitted to the discrepancies between the schools in classes and grading. ( This was at the March MVHS meeting ). Maybe it's the number of each class -- I am not sure-- I only listened to a Mom who obviously had her facts and a principal who was obviously aware of this ' discrepancy and grading issue ) - if the district actually has a plan to ' swing the pendulum back to center' as it put that night. I'm working on getting you the details |
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Post by steckdad on Apr 28, 2009 9:12:03 GMT -6
based on the school report cards, socially I have to disagree. economically WV and NN are similar. but WV is 23% black/hispanic where NN is at 9%. NN is very similar to NV socially. Those two schools have only a margin of 1.3% on the ACT. to compare WV to NN is a stretch IMO. so YOU have decided to make it something other than socioeconomics - your call, I choose not to look at it that way. To compare NN and NV socially is based on what ? - % Low income ? -- can't be Neuqua Valley 1.9% Naper Central 4.3% Naper North 8.5% Waubonsie 8.8% Language proficiency issue ? can't be this either Naper Central 0% Neuqua Valley 0.6% Waubonsie 2.6% Naper North 3.1% So again - the comparison is where ?? Sorry but it's Naper north and Waubonsie and North has a HIGHER % of language proficiency issue -- so please re-explain your position again since it is not low income % and it is not language proficiency - I'm not sure I'm understanding you. --------------------------------------------------- oh and a difference of 1.3 points is not 1.3% since the max score is not 100%. But the real comparsion as easily shown here is 25.4 and 22.5 NN is 13% higher - why ? the issue is why does 203 have so much higher a % of kids exceeding state exam levels ? not just meet & exceed -- Meet & Exceed Waubonsie 63.2 meets + 17.0 exceeds Neuqua 76.7 meet + 21.6 exceeds North 77.4 meets + 26.6 exceeds Central 79.7 meets + 28.3 exceeds and his same pattern starts after 3rd grade scores in ISATs- up until then 204 & 203 basically equal. What happens curriculum wise ? forgot to mention that 8% and 3% of a greater number of students means there are more low income/LP students at WV |
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Post by steckdad on Apr 28, 2009 9:13:26 GMT -6
Steckdad, What made you zero in on Black/Hispanic for a comparison? I said socially WV was not the same as NN and this was an example. |
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Post by doctorwho on Apr 28, 2009 9:14:53 GMT -6
I thought Jim Schmid just clarified this in an email posted in this thread earlier and said there are not more college prep classes at NV. Has anyone ever compared the two curriculums? ETA: I just looked at my course catalog and it is the same catalog for all three schools. Maybe you should ask him then - because he is the one that admitted to the discrepancies between the schools in classes and grading. ( This was at the March MVHS meeting ). Maybe it's the number of each class -- I am not sure-- I only listened to a Mom who obviously had her facts and a principal who was obviously aware of this ' discrepancy and grading issue ) - if the district actually has a plan to ' swing the pendulum back to center' as it put that night. I'm working on getting you the details okay - here are the details on this situation from someone I knew would know-- if any questions they should be directed to those who are running the schools - sorry for not having all the details the first time, but quite frankly this was new and disturbing news to me. concern I have is do we have these differences in MS also ? For HS prep. ? Did anyone whose child was not PA have grammar in English ? ( woefully lacking) - Was the content of advance track algebra the same for all ? how much does this also contribute to the ACT differences read below --------------------- Comparisons were done of the core classes offered in the high schools, and differences were found in the content taught. Thus, a district goal was set for core classes to have common assessments by 2012. Schmidt noted that one reason for the differences between these "same" classes is that teachers had an uncommon area of focus in their teaching. Of course, the biggest reason for differing content is the AMOUNT of content covered, but Schmidt did not specifically address the content differences between the schools. Schmidt noted that the pendulum did swing and that a process was in place to move that pendulum back. My concern is that the class content won't be "officially equal" until 2012!! Another concern is that the same classes became so varied to begin with. For example, why was content omitted in the science course at one school, yet thoroughly covered in the other school? One term used in the education arena is dumbing down. Is that what happened here? Teachers began the comparison of core classes 3 years ago, so this problem has been known! (Neuqua had been open only 6-7 yrs when the "pendulum swing" was noted.) Technically the schools offer the same classes. However, the curriculum for the classes is not the same! Each school has their own department standards. Same district-different department standards. The challenge now is among the departments. The departments must work together to correct the gaps in the content. They are being required to have common assessments by 2012, because of the differences (the gaps) that were found. When a parent mentioned her concern about her MV child being prepared for college, Schmidt said that the classes offered were the same at the high schools. When another parent then noted that the GOAL is for the core classes to be the same by 2012, Schmidt did address this inequality of classes. There is a process in place to change our SAME class offerings to EQUAL class offerings.The general public believes that the course content is equal. However, comparisons showed that not all classes are equal at the schools. Common course assessments are not required until 2012, and this requirement is for core classes only. |
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Post by steckdad on Apr 28, 2009 9:17:56 GMT -6
Maybe you should ask him then - because he is the one that admitted to the discrepancies between the schools in classes and grading. ( This was at the March MVHS meeting ). Maybe it's the number of each class -- I am not sure-- I only listened to a Mom who obviously had her facts and a principal who was obviously aware of this ' discrepancy and grading issue ) - if the district actually has a plan to ' swing the pendulum back to center' as it put that night. I'm working on getting you the details okay - here are the details on this situation from someone I knew would know-- if any questions they should be directed to those who are running the schools - sorry for not having all the details the first time, but quite frankly this was new and disturbing news to me. concern I have is do we have these differences in MS also ? For HS prep. ? Did anyone whose child was not PA have grammar in English ? ( woefully lacking) - Was the content of advance track algebra the same for all ? read below --------------------- Comparisons were done of the core classes offered in the high schools, and differences were found in the content taught. Thus, a district goal was set for core classes to have common assessments by 2012. Schmidt noted that one reason for the differences between these "same" classes is that teachers had an uncommon area of focus in their teaching. Of course, the biggest reason for differing content is the AMOUNT of content covered, but Schmidt did not specifically address the content differences between the schools. Schmidt noted that the pendulum did swing and that a process was in place to move that pendulum back. My concern is that the class content won't be "officially equal" until 2012!! Another concern is that the same classes became so varied to begin with. For example, why was content omitted in the science course at one school, yet thoroughly covered in the other school? One term used in the education arena is dumbing down. Is that what happened here? Teachers began the comparison of core classes 3 years ago, so this problem has been known! (Neuqua had been open only 6-7 yrs when the "pendulum swing" was noted.) Technically the schools offer the same classes. However, the curriculum for the classes is not the same! Each school has their own department standards. Same district-different department standards. The challenge now is among the departments. The departments must work together to correct the gaps in the content. They are being required to have common assessments by 2012, because of the differences (the gaps) that were found. When a parent mentioned her concern about her MV child being prepared for college, Schmidt said that the classes offered were the same at the high schools. When another parent then noted that the GOAL is for the core classes to be the same by 2012, Schmidt did address this inequality of classes. There is a process in place to change our SAME class offerings to EQUAL class offerings.The general public believes that the course content is equal. However, comparisons showed that not all classes are equal at the schools. Common course assessments are not required until 2012, and this requirement is for core classes only. not sure why they cant start teaching the same classes the same way in the fall? |
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Post by doctorwho on Apr 28, 2009 9:19:29 GMT -6
okay - here are the details on this situation from someone I knew would know-- if any questions they should be directed to those who are running the schools - sorry for not having all the details the first time, but quite frankly this was new and disturbing news to me. concern I have is do we have these differences in MS also ? For HS prep. ? Did anyone whose child was not PA have grammar in English ? ( woefully lacking) - Was the content of advance track algebra the same for all ? read below --------------------- Comparisons were done of the core classes offered in the high schools, and differences were found in the content taught. Thus, a district goal was set for core classes to have common assessments by 2012. Schmidt noted that one reason for the differences between these "same" classes is that teachers had an uncommon area of focus in their teaching. Of course, the biggest reason for differing content is the AMOUNT of content covered, but Schmidt did not specifically address the content differences between the schools. Schmidt noted that the pendulum did swing and that a process was in place to move that pendulum back. My concern is that the class content won't be "officially equal" until 2012!! Another concern is that the same classes became so varied to begin with. For example, why was content omitted in the science course at one school, yet thoroughly covered in the other school? One term used in the education arena is dumbing down. Is that what happened here? Teachers began the comparison of core classes 3 years ago, so this problem has been known! (Neuqua had been open only 6-7 yrs when the "pendulum swing" was noted.) Technically the schools offer the same classes. However, the curriculum for the classes is not the same! Each school has their own department standards. Same district-different department standards. The challenge now is among the departments. The departments must work together to correct the gaps in the content. They are being required to have common assessments by 2012, because of the differences (the gaps) that were found. When a parent mentioned her concern about her MV child being prepared for college, Schmidt said that the classes offered were the same at the high schools. When another parent then noted that the GOAL is for the core classes to be the same by 2012, Schmidt did address this inequality of classes. There is a process in place to change our SAME class offerings to EQUAL class offerings.The general public believes that the course content is equal. However, comparisons showed that not all classes are equal at the schools. Common course assessments are not required until 2012, and this requirement is for core classes only. not sure why they cant start teaching the same classes the same way in the fall? a very sound question - why will it take 3 more years to shift the 'pendulum' back. If my child was @ WVHS or getting ready to head there I'd be asking that question for sure--- and really never got a solid answer as is MVHS going to be in line with NV or WV ? |
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