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Post by concerned2 on Jul 17, 2008 11:37:07 GMT -6
.....as ones starts to peel the skin back it appears that the underlying motive and reason for most if not all off the unexplainable choices / decisions (boundaries, transportation / bus costs, railroad trax, expedite fees, backdoor negotiations, inflated enrollment, etc.) made by the SB over the last 2-3 years are really centered around one thing. By looking at the 2 identified pawns in this whole scheme it is the Watts & WE/TG communities. Clearly once the SB realized that having both at the same school (BB) would throw the whole D204 out of whack and their wasn't a community as strong as Watts to backfill their vacated school - they panicked and realized what they did. So you think all the decisions---(including dealing with very unfortunate BB land price jury verdict  ) -- boil down to issues and effects with Watts and WE/TG communities? This thinking is utterly incredible. This shows complete lack of district-wide perspective. To be blunt, I think this crazy attitude is very self-centered. Really??? The SB did not hide the fact that they were trying to get the higher achieving schools to bring up test scores. Remember the whole have and have nots and if you put a higher achieving student with lower achieving students that that student will do just fine. I believe this idea came from JC. After this was argued it went back to geography, but that idea was blown out of the water with the new site. |
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Post by twhl on Jul 17, 2008 11:39:31 GMT -6
.....as ones starts to peel the skin back it appears that the underlying motive and reason for most if not all off the unexplainable choices / decisions (boundaries, transportation / bus costs, railroad trax, expedite fees, backdoor negotiations, inflated enrollment, etc.) made by the SB over the last 2-3 years are really centered around one thing. By looking at the 2 identified pawns in this whole scheme it is the Watts & WE/TG communities. Clearly once the SB realized that having both at the same school (BB) would throw the whole D204 out of whack and their wasn't a community as strong as Watts to backfill their vacated school - they panicked and realized what they did. So you think all the decisions---(including dealing with very unfortunate BB land price jury verdict ) -- boil down to issues and effects with Watts and WE/TG communities? This thinking is utterly incredible. This shows complete lack of district-wide perspective. To be blunt, I think this crazy attitude is very self-centered. Its not as I always advise my staff to "sleep on it" and I have and circle back to the same stretch of rational conclusion. And spare the post about a district wide perspective - or did we forget singling out the bridge memo by SB / SD ? Was that for a "district-wide perspective. Should go both ways don't cha think ? GD - please give us a point by point on the opening thread points ? Please keep them district-wide and not just about your area. |
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Post by d204mom on Jul 17, 2008 12:03:43 GMT -6
.....as ones starts to peel the skin back it appears that the underlying motive and reason for most if not all off the unexplainable choices / decisions (boundaries, transportation / bus costs, railroad trax, expedite fees, backdoor negotiations, inflated enrollment, etc.) made by the SB over the last 2-3 years are really centered around one thing. By looking at the 2 identified pawns in this whole scheme it is the Watts & WE/TG communities. Clearly once the SB realized that having both at the same school (BB) would throw the whole D204 out of whack and their wasn't a community as strong as Watts to backfill their vacated school - they panicked and realized what they did. So you think all the decisions---(including dealing with very unfortunate BB land price jury verdict ) -- boil down to issues and effects with Watts and WE/TG communities? This thinking is utterly incredible. This shows complete lack of district-wide perspective. To be blunt, I think this crazy attitude is very self-centered. Is it self-centered to think that Gombert was used as a pawn in JC's Option 6? Or do you think she wanted you shipped over to NV because it was most convenient for you? Just because certain areas ended up with the pawn title doesn't mean it's a self centered perspective. It just means that they couldn't be used as pawns before the vote because the ref wouldn't have passed. Now that the vote is over everyone is fair game except the school board's neighborhoods (please don't tell me you think the Brighton Ridge switcheroo was done out of some sort of compassion from Metzger or Bradshaw!) ETA - and let's not forget about who was the ultimate pawn before the site change - Brookdale. If 5A was so great why did Bradshaw cry while casting the deciding vote? If I recall they were not tears of joy. |
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Post by gatordog on Jul 17, 2008 12:45:20 GMT -6
Okay, everyone's "entitled" to an opinion. So what do you believe the SB's motivation was? 1. Build a voter approved third HS 2. open a 7th MS 3. use available resources to do so. 4. adjust HS, MS, and ES boundaries in a way that meets established criteria of a) matching building enrollment capacities b) considers geography c) minimizes splits I believe their motivations were very straightforward |
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Post by Arch on Jul 17, 2008 12:54:36 GMT -6
because there was just 'no way' to have done all that in Oct 2007  |
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Post by concerned2 on Jul 17, 2008 13:32:49 GMT -6
Okay, everyone's "entitled" to an opinion. So what do you believe the SB's motivation was? 1. Build a voter approved third HS 2. open a 7th MS 3. use available resources to do so. 4. adjust HS, MS, and ES boundaries in a way that meets established criteria of a) matching building enrollment capacities b) considers geography c) minimizes splits I believe their motivations were very straightforward Geography and splits should be removed from your list as the SB could of done better in these areas and they needed to start with where they decided to build the 3rd HS. To me the site alone is not what is best ditrict wide and I really am too lazy to list all the reasons behind that statement. |
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Post by slp on Jul 17, 2008 13:52:38 GMT -6
Okay, everyone's "entitled" to an opinion. So what do you believe the SB's motivation was? 1. Build a voter approved third HS 2. open a 7th MS 3. use available resources to do so. 4. adjust HS, MS, and ES boundaries in a way that meets established criteria of a) matching building enrollment capacities b) considers geography c) minimizes splits I believe their motivations were very straightforward Honestly Gatordog, I used to believe that too . Not anymore. Being from Gombert you don't hear what I hear regarding the negativity aimed towards White Eagle based on what happened over 10 years ago! I have NO ILL WILL towards you or Gombert area, infact, I look forward to working with many of you at WVHS, but I will not sit quietly if I hear another Brookdale resident spout off about how they want Watts at MV because they want a Naperville presence and hearing another Brookdale resident spout off about how NVHS is a Taj Mahal and slamming those residents that don't want to leave it. All the while the school board only mentions supposed nasty emails from White Eagle and Tall Grass. Give me a brake! There are MANY in Brookdale that feel White Eagle going to WVHS is "payback". You know it and I know it. They are the ones who have given WVHS a bad name IMO. I'm glad they won't be there when we are quite frankly. eta: without a DOUBT I feel that those same sentiments existed in a couple of the long tenured SB members and when the opportunity presented itself they jumped from BB. They only chose BB (figuring it had a 50/50 chance of working out) to pass the referendum. They used us all. Had they educated the public about the need for a 3rd high school ONLY and NOT introduced boundaries into the scenario and the ref. had passed I don't think anyone would be as upset as they are now. It was THE BOARD that made boundaires the end-all-be-all and areas vote based on what they preferred. Brookdale made it very clear what they preferred when they voted NO, yet now they are not scolded like WE and TG were by the school board for their negativity that continues even today! |
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Post by researching on Jul 17, 2008 14:36:29 GMT -6
1. Build a voter approved third HS 2. open a 7th MS 3. use available resources to do so. 4. adjust HS, MS, and ES boundaries in a way that meets established criteria of a) matching building enrollment capacities b) considers geography c) minimizes splits I believe their motivations were very straightforward Honestly Gatordog, I used to believe that too . Not anymore. Being from Gombert you don't hear what I hear regarding the negativity aimed towards White Eagle based on what happened over 10 years ago! I have NO ILL WILL towards you or Gombert area, infact, I look forward to working with many of you at WVHS, but I will not sit quietly if I hear another Brookdale resident spout off about how they want Watts at MV because they want a Naperville presence and hearing another Brookdale resident spout off about how NVHS is a Taj Mahal and slamming those residents that don't want to leave it. All the while the school board only mentions supposed nasty emails from White Eagle and Tall Grass. Give me a brake! There are MANY in Brookdale that feel White Eagle going to WVHS is "payback". You know it and I know it. They are the ones who have given WVHS a bad name IMO. I'm glad they won't be there when we are quite frankly. eta: without a DOUBT I feel that those same sentiments existed in a couple of the long tenured SB members and when the opportunity presented itself they jumped from BB. They only chose BB (figuring it had a 50/50 chance of working out) to pass the referendum. They used us all. Had they educated the public about the need for a 3rd high school ONLY and NOT introduced boundaries into the scenario and the ref. had passed I don't think anyone would be as upset as they are now. It was THE BOARD that made boundaires the end-all-be-all and areas vote based on what they preferred. Brookdale made it very clear what they preferred when they voted NO, yet now they are not scolded like WE and TG were by the school board for their negativity that continues even today!Exactly. |
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Post by researching on Jul 17, 2008 14:39:51 GMT -6
1. Build a voter approved third HS 2. open a 7th MS 3. use available resources to do so. 4. adjust HS, MS, and ES boundaries in a way that meets established criteria of a) matching building enrollment capacities b) considers geography c) minimizes splits I believe their motivations were very straightforward Geography and splits should be removed from your list as the SB could of done better in these areas and they needed to start with where they decided to build the 3rd HS. To me the site alone is not what is best ditrict wide and I really am too lazy to list all the reasons behind that statement. Ditto here on all counts. My fingers refuse to yet again type the MANY MANY qualifications to my point of view on this topic. |
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Post by gatordog on Jul 17, 2008 14:49:27 GMT -6
1. Build a voter approved third HS 2. open a 7th MS 3. use available resources to do so. 4. adjust HS, MS, and ES boundaries in a way that meets established criteria of a) matching building enrollment capacities b) considers geography c) minimizes splits I believe their motivations were very straightforward Honestly Gatordog, I used to believe that too . Not anymore. Being from Gombert you don't hear what I hear regarding the negativity aimed towards White Eagle based on what happened over 10 years ago! I have NO ILL WILL towards you or Gombert area, infact, I look forward to working with many of you at WVHS, but I will not sit quietly if I hear another Brookdale resident spout off about how they want Watts at MV because they want a Naperville presence and hearing another Brookdale resident spout off about how NVHS is a Taj Mahal and slamming those residents that don't want to leave it. All the while the school board only mentions supposed nasty emails from White Eagle and Tall Grass. Give me a brake! There are MANY in Brookdale that feel White Eagle going to WVHS is "payback". You know it and I know it. They are the ones who have given WVHS a bad name IMO. I'm glad they won't be there when we are quite frankly. eta: without a DOUBT I feel that those same sentiments existed in a couple of the long tenured SB members and when the opportunity presented itself they jumped from BB. They only chose BB (figuring it had a 50/50 chance of working out) to pass the referendum. They used us all. Had they educated the public about the need for a 3rd high school ONLY and NOT introduced boundaries into the scenario and the ref. had passed I don't think anyone would be as upset as they are now. It was THE BOARD that made boundaires the end-all-be-all and areas vote based on what they preferred. Brookdale made it very clear what they preferred when they voted NO, yet now they are not scolded like WE and TG were by the school board for their negativity that continues even today! slp, thanks for expressing this. But let me say this: it seems like its expressing everything that has happened as "BD vs WE/TG". I see what you are saying, because.... Could 2006 Boundary Wars Option 5 or 6 be framed in terms of BD vs WE/TG? Yes. Could ref vote 2006 be framed in terms of BD vs WE/TG? in some regards, yes. Could AME site and NSFOC lawsuit be framed in terms of BD vs. WE/TG? Probably. But from my non-BD/WE/TG point of view, 90% of the SD doesnt care a bit for this pointless political squabble. We have seen enough of it!   Many of us just wish these neighborhoods would either "cut it out, or take your fight outside and not bother the rest of us with it"  |
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Post by Arch on Jul 17, 2008 15:11:55 GMT -6
Honestly Gatordog, I used to believe that too . Not anymore. Being from Gombert you don't hear what I hear regarding the negativity aimed towards White Eagle based on what happened over 10 years ago! I have NO ILL WILL towards you or Gombert area, infact, I look forward to working with many of you at WVHS, but I will not sit quietly if I hear another Brookdale resident spout off about how they want Watts at MV because they want a Naperville presence and hearing another Brookdale resident spout off about how NVHS is a Taj Mahal and slamming those residents that don't want to leave it. All the while the school board only mentions supposed nasty emails from White Eagle and Tall Grass. Give me a brake! There are MANY in Brookdale that feel White Eagle going to WVHS is "payback". You know it and I know it. They are the ones who have given WVHS a bad name IMO. I'm glad they won't be there when we are quite frankly. eta: without a DOUBT I feel that those same sentiments existed in a couple of the long tenured SB members and when the opportunity presented itself they jumped from BB. They only chose BB (figuring it had a 50/50 chance of working out) to pass the referendum. They used us all. Had they educated the public about the need for a 3rd high school ONLY and NOT introduced boundaries into the scenario and the ref. had passed I don't think anyone would be as upset as they are now. It was THE BOARD that made boundaires the end-all-be-all and areas vote based on what they preferred. Brookdale made it very clear what they preferred when they voted NO, yet now they are not scolded like WE and TG were by the school board for their negativity that continues even today! slp, thanks for expressing this. But let me say this: it seems like its expressing everything that has happened as "BD vs WE/TG". I see what you are saying, because.... Could 2006 Boundary Wars Option 5 or 6 be framed in terms of BD vs WE/TG? Yes. Could ref vote 2006 be framed in terms of BD vs WE/TG? in some regards, yes. Could AME site and NSFOC lawsuit be framed in terms of BD vs. WE/TG? Probably. But from my non-BD/WE/TG point of view, 90% of the SD doesnt care a bit for this pointless political squabble. We have seen enough of it! Many of us just wish these neighborhoods would either "cut it out, or take your fight outside and not bother the rest of us with it" Unfortunately, it appears as though it's been leveraged and played to get certain outcomes. |
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Post by slp on Jul 17, 2008 15:22:02 GMT -6
Honestly Gatordog, I used to believe that too . Not anymore. Being from Gombert you don't hear what I hear regarding the negativity aimed towards White Eagle based on what happened over 10 years ago! I have NO ILL WILL towards you or Gombert area, infact, I look forward to working with many of you at WVHS, but I will not sit quietly if I hear another Brookdale resident spout off about how they want Watts at MV because they want a Naperville presence and hearing another Brookdale resident spout off about how NVHS is a Taj Mahal and slamming those residents that don't want to leave it. All the while the school board only mentions supposed nasty emails from White Eagle and Tall Grass. Give me a brake! There are MANY in Brookdale that feel White Eagle going to WVHS is "payback". You know it and I know it. They are the ones who have given WVHS a bad name IMO. I'm glad they won't be there when we are quite frankly. eta: without a DOUBT I feel that those same sentiments existed in a couple of the long tenured SB members and when the opportunity presented itself they jumped from BB. They only chose BB (figuring it had a 50/50 chance of working out) to pass the referendum. They used us all. Had they educated the public about the need for a 3rd high school ONLY and NOT introduced boundaries into the scenario and the ref. had passed I don't think anyone would be as upset as they are now. It was THE BOARD that made boundaires the end-all-be-all and areas vote based on what they preferred. Brookdale made it very clear what they preferred when they voted NO, yet now they are not scolded like WE and TG were by the school board for their negativity that continues even today! slp, thanks for expressing this. But let me say this: it seems like its expressing everything that has happened as "BD vs WE/TG". I see what you are saying, because.... Could 2006 Boundary Wars Option 5 or 6 be framed in terms of BD vs WE/TG? Yes. Could ref vote 2006 be framed in terms of BD vs WE/TG? in some regards, yes. Could AME site and NSFOC lawsuit be framed in terms of BD vs. WE/TG? Probably. But from my non-BD/WE/TG point of view, 90% of the SD doesnt care a bit for this pointless political squabble. We have seen enough of it! Many of us just wish these neighborhoods would either "cut it out, or take your fight outside and not bother the rest of us with it" I see your point , and believe me, I have been very ready to move on. I have been around more WVHS families as of late due to my kids involvement at WV programs and when I hear the ugly comments made by Brookdale folks it gets my goat! |
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Post by concerned2 on Jul 17, 2008 15:27:32 GMT -6
slp, thanks for expressing this. But let me say this: it seems like its expressing everything that has happened as "BD vs WE/TG". I see what you are saying, because.... Could 2006 Boundary Wars Option 5 or 6 be framed in terms of BD vs WE/TG? Yes. Could ref vote 2006 be framed in terms of BD vs WE/TG? in some regards, yes. Could AME site and NSFOC lawsuit be framed in terms of BD vs. WE/TG? Probably. But from my non-BD/WE/TG point of view, 90% of the SD doesnt care a bit for this pointless political squabble. We have seen enough of it! Many of us just wish these neighborhoods would either "cut it out, or take your fight outside and not bother the rest of us with it" Unfortunately, it appears as though it's been leveraged and played to get certain outcomes. Ditto!!!!!! |
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Post by specailneedsmom on Jul 17, 2008 15:33:20 GMT -6
Gatordog, I think you are right in saying that 90% of the district does not care -- I would take it a step further and say that 90% of the people in the affected areas don't care either. But I don't thing the vocal 10% will cut it out until they can communicate their feelings to the SB and Admin in a constructive manner. I also don't think that since this is a public domain that discussing it here is not appropriate. This is the outside.
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Post by slp on Jul 17, 2008 15:40:12 GMT -6
I still recall the beginning of the Brookdale sarcasm shortly after the AME site was finalized....it was a post on this board by "Brookdale Mom" stating how valuable their real estate would become there with a beautiful new high school down the road and other sarcastic comments. IMO since the day NVHS opened, Brookdale has had an enormous chip on their shoulder and are the ones who have felt "entitled" to a new school from day 1 and that is why they originally voted NO.
Perhaps Gatordog is right though; most people besides WE/TG and Watts really don't care about the Brookdale sarcasm and chip on their shoulder . BUT, it should have been the duty of the board to have been impartial to this 10plus year issue and they clearly WERE NOT. JC's wearing of the ORANGE Option 6 shirt spoke volumes that I will NEVER FORGET.
Anyway, all water under the bridge until I hear the nasty comments , then I let loose! ha!
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) -- boil down to issues and effects with Watts and WE/TG communities?
