SB Options for BB now

[casey]

gatormom said:

No. But it is a better site for the school, IMO, than Macom.

I don't honestly see how St. John's could be considered a better site. I'm not saying that Macom is the answer but St. John's has several things going against it:

1) Very far North location - School is not located where the big percentage of growth is - south side
2) Busy traffic area (soon to be worse with Ferry Road entrance ramp to 88 to be added). Maybe seen as more dangerous?
3) Need to condemn the land - we know how that went over last time. Takes more time to get building?
4) Cost still to be determined?

[momto4]

gatormom said:

macy said:

Are you in favor of condemnation of the St. John's property?

No. But it is a better site for the school, IMO, than Macom.

I agree that it's a better site and location than Macom.

However, traffic in that area is already an absolute nightmare at certain times of day and I can't imagine adding a stoplight that close to the existing lights. When/if the tollway interchange gets put in it will only be worse.

I wonder if there would be any way to exit out to Diehl as well as Eola (I know there's land in between, so not sure if something could be worked out).

I'm still hopeful that things will work out at BB anyway.

[gatordog]

archwinsome said:

macy said:

Are you in favor of condemnation of the St. John's property?

As we've seen, condemnation is a gamble... I'd rather work w/ current owners to get a fair settlement without all the court costs. However...

If there was a church on the property.. no, don't even consider condemnation.

Since there's not I see it in the same light of Macom and BB... Needs of the many...

Condemn the church property? Absolutely not. The only way to move on it is to make it favorable deal with the church. This option is only viable if its win-win for both SD and the church.

I am not a lawyer but....I dont think condemnation of anything is an option because the SD was given land once via condemnation. How can you say "your land must be condemned because its the only land available for the public need" when you just walked away from different property that was deemed suitable for that need. I dont think you can condemn land because the previous land you were shooting for was deemed to costly. Second reason, of course is schedule.

There wont be further condemnation actions occuring for MVHS land...its not an option.

[gatormom]

casey said:

gatormom said:

No. But it is a better site for the school, IMO, than Macom.

I don't honestly see how St. John's could be considered a better site. I'm not saying that Macom is the answer but St. John's has several things going against it:

1) Very far North location - School is not located where the big percentage of growth is - south side
2) Busy traffic area (soon to be worse with Ferry Road entrance ramp to 88 to be added). Maybe seen as more dangerous?
3) Need to condemn the land - we know how that went over last time. Takes more time to get building?
4) Cost still to be determined?

Macom, last I heard, needed about 30 to 60 days to get the municipal changes made, has Wolf's Crossing been moved yet? Lack of decent access, architectural work needs to be completely redone, and while PL's architects plopped all the major components of the school on that plot of land, the district said it is not a workable plan. Macom has railroad, power lines, and a huge switching station butting up against it. Sorry, it is really not a place to put a high school and finally, way too far south for the district.

I agree, there are many unknowns with the church land but as Arch said, if an agreement could be made, no condemnation, it would be a far better option than Macom, IMO.

[Arch]

I'm not advocating that as a course of action, but if it came down to it I'd say do it if the only alternative was no 3rd HS.

[gatordog]

wvhsparent said:

gatordog said:

For the St John's AME property:
For his congregation, the pastor wants land to the south and east....he doesnt want to move further west. This info was in the site analysis report.

Its not just a matter of us saying SD can maybe get this land for less. The church has land right now that meets their needs. Unless the church knows that they can get other land that also meets there needs...I cant see them making a deal. This isnt a for-profit outfit that will be happy with a big profit on their land purchase if they are unable to buy land south and east.

Would a land swap with Wheatland ES be a possibility? I am doubtful... the size of a church built at Wheatland would be way smaller than what St John's can do at Eola/Molitor. Given the valuable route 59 frontage, would a swap even be financially advantageous to the SD? Maybe not.

Unless somebody can point to replace land to the south and east for the church...I am doubtful that this church property is seriously "on the table".

How big is this parcel? Is there enough room for a church and MVHS? A M-F institution and a primarily Sunday building could be good neighbors. They could share parking...like WVHS does with the church just to north. I am not sure if this is feasible from a land-layout perspective. But maybe this would be an enticement to make it a good deal for the church too.

South and East? Hmmmm was'nt the Bonk farm that way?, How about the parcel at Ferry and 59? It's further East and would have nice exposure for the Church?
Ooooh! How about that area at 75th and Book behind the Home Depot. They wanted to put apts/townhomes there (That the SD opposed)...why not a church?
Those are just a few possible land swaps that might work.

If only it were easy...maybe the church would jump! However...

Bonk farm: is south of 111th street, in Bolingbrook. I am not sure if church wants to go THAT far south....you'd have to hear from them. Given that they are holding services at Granger MS....I am doubtful that they would see that as a better piece of land than what they have (just my hunch)

Ferry and 59: is slightly N of churches current site and is zoned commericial. Commericial property close to tollway may be expensive.

The and 75th and Book land behind Home Depot: Seems plausible option for St Johns. One thing I can say with confidence: the owners of this land must have been really happy with BB jury verdict!

[gatordog]

casey said:

gatormom said:

No. But it is a better site for the school, IMO, than Macom.

I don't honestly see how St. John's could be considered a better site. I'm not saying that Macom is the answer but St. John's has several things going against it:

1) Very far North location - School is not located where the big percentage of growth is - south side
2) Busy traffic area (soon to be worse with Ferry Road entrance ramp to 88 to be added). Maybe seen as more dangerous?
3) Need to condemn the land - we know how that went over last time. Takes more time to get building?
4) Cost still to be determined?

St John's property has power line issues as well. The site analysis report mentions "two high energy electrical switching substations"

[rew]

I believe a "Whole Foods Market" is planned for the Home Depot property, and the townhomes are going next door...signs are up.

I am reading all your posts and come to one conclusion..this is how we ended up with BB. I do think all of your concerns about the different parcels are valid. The question becomes which site has the lesser of evils.

That it what always brings me back to BB, write a check, start digging.

(I am willing to explore the other options, just very quickly please.)

[gatordog]

rew said:

That it what always brings me back to BB, write a check, start digging.

(I am willing to explore the other options, just very quickly please.)

this is my position too currently. Benefit vs cost may still be higher at BB than other sites, unless it can be shown otherwise.

One cost reduction idea: Does MVHS need football stadium? Yes, have fully equipped "minor" (not minor in importance...just in crowd size!) sports fields and practice fields, including football practice. But to handle the big crowds on about six friday nights each year...just let the football team and band go to WV or NV stadium.

[momof3]

rew said:

I believe a "Whole Foods Market" is planned for the Home Depot property, and the townhomes are going next door...signs are up.

I was assuming that wvhsparent meant the land east of HD and N of 75th at Book. That land is still open but it is a small parcel - 12 acres (area proposed for "Prairie View Apartments").
The land directly across from Cowlishaw near Home Depot (I believe) already has site work nearing completion and the street forms are up - "Mayfair" by Kimball Homes.

[momof3]

gatordog said:

rew said:

That it what always brings me back to BB, write a check, start digging.

(I am willing to explore the other options, just very quickly please.)

this is my position too currently. Benefit vs cost may still be higher at BB than other sites, unless it can be shown otherwise.

One cost reduction idea: Does MVHS need football stadium? Yes, have fully equipped "minor" (not minor in importance...just in crowd size!) sports fields and practice fields, including football practice. But to handle the big crowds on about six friday nights each year...just let the football team and band go to WV or NV stadium.

Is it even 6 games if you take into account games played at North Central College?

[doctorwho]

momof3 said:

gatordog said:

this is my position too currently. Benefit vs cost may still be higher at BB than other sites, unless it can be shown otherwise.

One cost reduction idea: Does MVHS need football stadium? Yes, have fully equipped "minor" (not minor in importance...just in crowd size!) sports fields and practice fields, including football practice. But to handle the big crowds on about six friday nights each year...just let the football team and band go to WV or NV stadium.

Is it even 6 games if you take into account games played at North Central College?

usually contains track also.

[wvhsparent]

casey said:

gatormom said:

No. But it is a better site for the school, IMO, than Macom.

I don't honestly see how St. John's could be considered a better site. I'm not saying that Macom is the answer but St. John's has several things going against it:

1) Very far North location - School is not located where the big percentage of growth is - south side
2) Busy traffic area (soon to be worse with Ferry Road entrance ramp to 88 to be added). Maybe seen as more dangerous?
3) Need to condemn the land - we know how that went over last time. Takes more time to get building?
4) Cost still to be determined?

1) Get out of the "where the growth is" mentality. There are enought students i the northern part to support a school...why does have to be "new growth"?
2) The ramp may actually relieve some of the congestion. Might actually help those of us who need to try and use Eola to get to WVHS now (which is terrible)
3) Who said we need to condemn? I would agree that is not a good thing with church property, built or not. How about serious negotiating?
4) cost TBD....yep....less than BB? most definitely...remember they got it for 6 mil...offer them 15 up to 20.....nice chunk o change and after selling back of 25 acres to BB minus fees, we would still be less than what they were originally trying to get BB for...more for the building then.

[wvhsparent]

gatordog said:

casey said:

I don't honestly see how St. John's could be considered a better site. I'm not saying that Macom is the answer but St. John's has several things going against it:

1) Very far North location - School is not located where the big percentage of growth is - south side
2) Busy traffic area (soon to be worse with Ferry Road entrance ramp to 88 to be added). Maybe seen as more dangerous?
3) Need to condemn the land - we know how that went over last time. Takes more time to get building?
4) Cost still to be determined?

St John's property has power line issues as well. The site analysis report mentions "two high energy electrical switching substations"

IMHO That was PR spin. The electrical stuff is actually pretty far away from the site. (It's just off Diehl Rd) with several other properties between them.

[wvhsparent]

gatordog said:

wvhsparent said:

South and East? Hmmmm was'nt the Bonk farm that way?, How about the parcel at Ferry and 59? It's further East and would have nice exposure for the Church?
Ooooh! How about that area at 75th and Book behind the Home Depot. They wanted to put apts/townhomes there (That the SD opposed)...why not a church?
Those are just a few possible land swaps that might work.

If only it were easy...maybe the church would jump! However...

Bonk farm: is south of 111th street, in Bolingbrook. I am not sure if church wants to go THAT far south....you'd have to hear from them. Given that they are holding services at Granger MS....I am doubtful that they would see that as a better piece of land than what they have (just my hunch)

Ferry and 59: is slightly N of churches current site and is zoned commericial. Commericial property close to tollway may be expensive.

The and 75th and Book land behind Home Depot: Seems plausible option for St Johns. One thing I can say with confidence: the owners of this land must have been really happy with BB jury verdict!

SW corner of Rt59 and Ferry....Parcel # 07-03-102-007 has been open and vacant for a loooong time.......Currently zoned farmland.

What was the site that was right next to NVHS? I thought that was Bonk Farm.

Bummer about the site near the Home Depot. But also remember they could look outside the district for land too.
There is also a large tract on North Aurora Rd just e/o EJ&E. not big enough for a HS, but maybe a Church. I know they were thinking about putting a STAR Line Station there some day (ok probably never), but the Church could rent out parking during the week then too.

I personally have never been able to really come up with any reason the BB is a good site. Pre or Post verdict......sorry.