Music education cuts? from the GREEN blog 3.15.10

[doctorwho]

Mar 16, 2010 13:44:06 GMT -6 casey said:

You knw the other thing that I have a hard time understanding is how all these teacher unions stand back and will never make concessions to save jobs. It's the same thing all over the state - the unions talk about all the jobs lost but then refuse to take a pay cut, pay more healthcare, teach more classes, etc. to save others' jobs. They're willing to sabotage the non-tenured teachers to save their own asses. In other words once you're in our secret club we'll take care of you but until then "buh bye!".

I hope that our teacher contract negotiations are making some headway. I'd hate to see our district sell out like they did in 203. The economy sucks, everyone is feeling the hit, and things will need to change. Let's see what that means.

March 22 should be an interesting meeting, eh?

as someone who has worked 70 hurs + per week for the last 3 weeks and regularly works 55 or so-- it does make you wonder. They always want to compare salaries ( but not benefits) to the private sector when it suits them, but geez- don't ask for any concessions whatsoever.
I can see me telling my bosses- that meeting Wednesday mornings- your gonna have to start work later so that I can make it--- or when I have to attend calls from around the world at all unGodly hours- to say, hey sorry, it's not within the work day

unbelievable-- again out of touch with the rest of the world

[steckdad]

Mar 16, 2010 7:59:14 GMT -6 brant said:

Mar 16, 2010 6:56:56 GMT -6 macrockett said:

Like the three threads in off topic? It's called providing information that people might want to read but don't need to comment on Steckdad.

Looking around the Board today I can see you have ingratiated yourself to one and all, again.

I can certainly see why you would not want to reveal who you really are... or provide any facts worth reading for that matter.

Many of us on this board have different viewpoints and exchange ideas but personal attacks are not constructive or welcome Steckdad.

not a personal attack brant.

[warriordiva]

Mar 16, 2010 14:21:47 GMT -6 @steckdad said:

Mar 16, 2010 7:59:14 GMT -6 brant said:

Many of us on this board have different viewpoints and exchange ideas but personal attacks are not constructive or welcome Steckdad.

not a personal attack brant.

"lastly, you do not try to be nice on this board or green....actually you are quite nasty IMO"

Hmm not a personal attack? Really? Perhaps not on brant...

[refbasics]

Mar 15, 2010 9:56:06 GMT -6 refbasics said:

FROM momto4

Re: Music education cuts?« Result #1 Today at 9:32am »
Here is what I received in an e-mail and what is also posted in the info section of the Save Quality Music Education in District 204 Facebook group. I have not yet verified this info and I do not know the creator of the group.=======================================

Spread the word: Please let people know that the rich offerings in music education in District 204 are in jeopardy. The programs that feed into Metea Valley, Waubonsie Valley and Neuqua Valley are being cut - significantly.

Please read this Breaking News followed by what we’d like you to do.

The music program in District 204 is facing unprecedented budget cuts. A large percentage of staff will be removed from mostly middle school programs throughout the district resulting in a staggering change to a program that has garnered attention for its dedication to music education. We have heard that up to 20 of the current music staff in District 204, mostly teachers of band and orchestra instruments, will be gone at the end of the current school year. What is the consequence of this? No individual instruction will be given at the middle school level. Students will ONLY meet in large groups.

No one can deny that the State of Illinois and Indian Prairie School District 204 are facing challenging financial times. It’s true and difficult decisions must be made. But never in the history of our school district have such targeted cuts been proposed to severely impact ONE program - especially one of the most successful programs in the nation for music education. To remove teachers at the lower levels will, in a short time, have a negative impact on Metea Valley, Waubonsie Valley and Neuqua Valley High Schools.

In the past when cuts have been made they seem to have been proportionate; everyone feels some pain but in this case, the music program is being completely altered by this decision. Individual instruction in the younger grade levels is the foundation of the program. It is illogical to cut the “key component” that teaches the important skills needed for competency and future success. We know if they take away this part of the program it will be extremely difficult to reinstate in the future.

Our message to the Administration and School Board is this:
There must be another solution. Our music program is too precious to dismantle. Ask the administrators of our district and school board members to defend their decision to essentially “gut” the music program. Ask them how they could target something that works so well. Ask administrators and board members to go back to the drawing board. We are certain that together with the music teachers that they will come up with ideas that maintain the structure of the solid music program we have come to expect. Ask: “WHY”?

Here’s how you can take ACTION:

Contact Superintendent, Kathryn Birkett and our School Board members. Let them know why you think this program is beneficial for students and should be maintained. Cuts do not have to be this drastic. Please share positive anecdotes. Keep all correspondence civil and respectful.

If you are a parent, student, alumni, or just plain someone who enjoys music, please take ACTION.............
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
from gatordog the GREEN BLOG 3.16.10
ip204.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=recent

"Re: Music education cuts?
« Result #2 Today at 10:57am »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Today at 10:20am, Arwen wrote:....Personally, I think ADK should be eliminated. We couldn't afford it in the first place. We relied on $ from the state and went ahead and implemented before we had the $. We can thank Dr. D for that one. Sorry for those older K students, had one myself, but as a SD we have to think of the whole not just a handful.

Quote:I agree with you. I think we should roll it back, charge tuition like Batavia is doing and/or make more half day classrooms around the district so more parents see it as a viable option.

I fully agree with both of you. What would the SD be like without free ADK for everyone? Well, we all know from two-yr ago experience, dont we?

Yes, the cuts would hit hardest on one group of teachers: those brought in to teach K. My feeling is we get more educational value retaining more teachers at the higher ES, MS, and HS levels."
--------------------------

at my local ES, upper level teachers chose to move down to teach kindergarten, and new teachers were brought in to teach 3rd & 4th.. so the ex-K teachers will move back up to the upper grades.

[doctorwho]

Mar 16, 2010 15:50:54 GMT -6 refbasics said:

Mar 15, 2010 9:56:06 GMT -6 refbasics said:

FROM momto4

Re: Music education cuts?« Result #1 Today at 9:32am »
Here is what I received in an e-mail and what is also posted in the info section of the Save Quality Music Education in District 204 Facebook group. I have not yet verified this info and I do not know the creator of the group.=======================================

Spread the word: Please let people know that the rich offerings in music education in District 204 are in jeopardy. The programs that feed into Metea Valley, Waubonsie Valley and Neuqua Valley are being cut - significantly.

Please read this Breaking News followed by what we’d like you to do.

The music program in District 204 is facing unprecedented budget cuts. A large percentage of staff will be removed from mostly middle school programs throughout the district resulting in a staggering change to a program that has garnered attention for its dedication to music education. We have heard that up to 20 of the current music staff in District 204, mostly teachers of band and orchestra instruments, will be gone at the end of the current school year. What is the consequence of this? No individual instruction will be given at the middle school level. Students will ONLY meet in large groups.

No one can deny that the State of Illinois and Indian Prairie School District 204 are facing challenging financial times. It’s true and difficult decisions must be made. But never in the history of our school district have such targeted cuts been proposed to severely impact ONE program - especially one of the most successful programs in the nation for music education. To remove teachers at the lower levels will, in a short time, have a negative impact on Metea Valley, Waubonsie Valley and Neuqua Valley High Schools.

In the past when cuts have been made they seem to have been proportionate; everyone feels some pain but in this case, the music program is being completely altered by this decision. Individual instruction in the younger grade levels is the foundation of the program. It is illogical to cut the “key component” that teaches the important skills needed for competency and future success. We know if they take away this part of the program it will be extremely difficult to reinstate in the future.

Our message to the Administration and School Board is this:
There must be another solution. Our music program is too precious to dismantle. Ask the administrators of our district and school board members to defend their decision to essentially “gut” the music program. Ask them how they could target something that works so well. Ask administrators and board members to go back to the drawing board. We are certain that together with the music teachers that they will come up with ideas that maintain the structure of the solid music program we have come to expect. Ask: “WHY”?

Here’s how you can take ACTION:

Contact Superintendent, Kathryn Birkett and our School Board members. Let them know why you think this program is beneficial for students and should be maintained. Cuts do not have to be this drastic. Please share positive anecdotes. Keep all correspondence civil and respectful.

If you are a parent, student, alumni, or just plain someone who enjoys music, please take ACTION.............
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
from gatordog the GREEN BLOG 3.16.10
ip204.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=recent

"Re: Music education cuts?
« Result #2 Today at 10:57am »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Today at 10:20am, Arwen wrote:....Personally, I think ADK should be eliminated. We couldn't afford it in the first place. We relied on $ from the state and went ahead and implemented before we had the $. We can thank Dr. D for that one. Sorry for those older K students, had one myself, but as a SD we have to think of the whole not just a handful.

Quote:I agree with you. I think we should roll it back, charge tuition like Batavia is doing and/or make more half day classrooms around the district so more parents see it as a viable option.

I fully agree with both of you. What would the SD be like without free ADK for everyone? Well, we all know from two-yr ago experience, dont we?

Yes, the cuts would hit hardest on one group of teachers: those brought in to teach K. My feeling is we get more educational value retaining more teachers at the higher ES, MS, and HS levels."
--------------------------

at my local ES, upper level teachers chose to move down to teach kindergarten, and new teachers were brought in to teach 3rd & 4th.. so the ex-K teachers will move back up to the upper grades.

"Today at 10:20am, Arwen wrote:....Personally, I think ADK should be eliminated. We couldn't afford it in the first place. We relied on $ from the state and went ahead and implemented before we had the $. We can thank Dr. D for that one. Sorry for those older K students, had one myself, but as a SD we have to think of the whole not just a handful.
"

really- it was all Dr D's idea ? hmmm..just again not true-- but wouldn't want to blame her precious SB or Admin on that one. BTW- who was ass't super then when the decision was made ? Oh yeah, our current super. Did our finance director think it was a bad idea ? Nope...
the leadership here continues to make stupid decisions and sheep follow them no matter what - blame the guy that's gone. Dr D was not a total ruler here when he was here-- there are times I think the guy was used by M2 and gang to get the school up north..then let him go a year early once the MV deed was done.

[slp]

wow, cannot believe there is a facebook page to "save" the music program. What about a facebook page to preserve the core academics as well....that is my concern. I don't want our kids in classrooms with 30 plus kids.

While the music education in IPSD is outstanding, if we cannot afford it , we cannot afford it.

Areas of focus should be core curriculum and if students/parents who want individual music lessons are that upset , then they can pay for their child to have lessons outside of school.

I know that may sound harsh, but that is the reality.

[rew]

In my old school district , they phased in ADK, first it was optional, they charged tuition, eventually (after 3 years or so) they had an operating ref to fund it and it passed. I would say it is near impossible to take ADK away now or charge for it...parents will be in an uproar.

[macy]

Mar 16, 2010 16:56:15 GMT -6 slp said:

wow, cannot believe there is a facebook page to "save" the music program. What about a facebook page to preserve the core academics as well....that is my concern. I don't want our kids in classrooms with 30 plus kids.

While the music education in IPSD is outstanding, if we cannot afford it , we cannot afford it.

Areas of focus should be core curriculum and if students/parents who want individual music lessons are that upset , then they can pay for their child to have lessons outside of school.

I know that may sound harsh, but that is the reality.

totally agree! Our music program is phenominal but... core classes are so much more important.

Just my opinion!

[macy]

Mar 16, 2010 16:07:07 GMT -6 doctorwho said:

Mar 16, 2010 15:50:54 GMT -6 refbasics said:

Mar 15, 2010 9:56:06 GMT -6 refbasics said:

FROM momto4

Re: Music education cuts?« Result #1 Today at 9:32am »
Here is what I received in an e-mail and what is also posted in the info section of the Save Quality Music Education in District 204 Facebook group. I have not yet verified this info and I do not know the creator of the group.=======================================

Spread the word: Please let people know that the rich offerings in music education in District 204 are in jeopardy. The programs that feed into Metea Valley, Waubonsie Valley and Neuqua Valley are being cut - significantly.

Please read this Breaking News followed by what we’d like you to do.

The music program in District 204 is facing unprecedented budget cuts. A large percentage of staff will be removed from mostly middle school programs throughout the district resulting in a staggering change to a program that has garnered attention for its dedication to music education. We have heard that up to 20 of the current music staff in District 204, mostly teachers of band and orchestra instruments, will be gone at the end of the current school year. What is the consequence of this? No individual instruction will be given at the middle school level. Students will ONLY meet in large groups.

No one can deny that the State of Illinois and Indian Prairie School District 204 are facing challenging financial times. It’s true and difficult decisions must be made. But never in the history of our school district have such targeted cuts been proposed to severely impact ONE program - especially one of the most successful programs in the nation for music education. To remove teachers at the lower levels will, in a short time, have a negative impact on Metea Valley, Waubonsie Valley and Neuqua Valley High Schools.

In the past when cuts have been made they seem to have been proportionate; everyone feels some pain but in this case, the music program is being completely altered by this decision. Individual instruction in the younger grade levels is the foundation of the program. It is illogical to cut the “key component” that teaches the important skills needed for competency and future success. We know if they take away this part of the program it will be extremely difficult to reinstate in the future.

Our message to the Administration and School Board is this:
There must be another solution. Our music program is too precious to dismantle. Ask the administrators of our district and school board members to defend their decision to essentially “gut” the music program. Ask them how they could target something that works so well. Ask administrators and board members to go back to the drawing board. We are certain that together with the music teachers that they will come up with ideas that maintain the structure of the solid music program we have come to expect. Ask: “WHY”?

Here’s how you can take ACTION:

Contact Superintendent, Kathryn Birkett and our School Board members. Let them know why you think this program is beneficial for students and should be maintained. Cuts do not have to be this drastic. Please share positive anecdotes. Keep all correspondence civil and respectful.

If you are a parent, student, alumni, or just plain someone who enjoys music, please take ACTION.............
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
from gatordog the GREEN BLOG 3.16.10
ip204.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=recent

"Re: Music education cuts?
« Result #2 Today at 10:57am »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Today at 10:20am, Arwen wrote:....Personally, I think ADK should be eliminated. We couldn't afford it in the first place. We relied on $ from the state and went ahead and implemented before we had the $. We can thank Dr. D for that one. Sorry for those older K students, had one myself, but as a SD we have to think of the whole not just a handful.

Quote:I agree with you. I think we should roll it back, charge tuition like Batavia is doing and/or make more half day classrooms around the district so more parents see it as a viable option.

I fully agree with both of you. What would the SD be like without free ADK for everyone? Well, we all know from two-yr ago experience, dont we?

Yes, the cuts would hit hardest on one group of teachers: those brought in to teach K. My feeling is we get more educational value retaining more teachers at the higher ES, MS, and HS levels."
--------------------------

at my local ES, upper level teachers chose to move down to teach kindergarten, and new teachers were brought in to teach 3rd & 4th.. so the ex-K teachers will move back up to the upper grades.

"Today at 10:20am, Arwen wrote:....Personally, I think ADK should be eliminated. We couldn't afford it in the first place. We relied on $ from the state and went ahead and implemented before we had the $. We can thank Dr. D for that one. Sorry for those older K students, had one myself, but as a SD we have to think of the whole not just a handful.
"

really- it was all Dr D's idea ? hmmm..just again not true-- but wouldn't want to blame her precious SB or Admin on that one. BTW- who was ass't super then when the decision was made ? Oh yeah, our current super. Did our finance director think it was a bad idea ? Nope...
the leadership here continues to make stupid decisions and sheep follow them no matter what - blame the guy that's gone. Dr D was not a total ruler here when he was here-- there are times I think the guy was used by M2 and gang to get the school up north..then let him go a year early once the MV deed was done.

wow... weren't we fed the BS from the board and Super Dr. Dashole that told us that all day K would actually save the district money? Wondering if that is still the case today with the budget crisis in Illinois. anyone know the answer to that question?

[doctorwho]

Mar 16, 2010 17:38:04 GMT -6 rew said:

In my old school district , they phased in ADK, first it was optional, they charged tuition, eventually (after 3 years or so) they had an operating ref to fund it and it passed. I would say it is near impossible to take ADK away now or charge for it...parents will be in an uproar.

they are going to have plenty more to be in an uproar about-- this was another 'money making SCHEME by 204 to load the coffers with state money- problem is the state doesn't have any more, and didn't have any when we started this.

I am surprised we don't have refrigerators at Wheatland loaded with government cheese..

[casey]

Mar 16, 2010 18:20:40 GMT -6 doctorwho said:

I am surprised we don't have refrigerators at Wheatland loaded with government cheese..

Speaking of Wheatland, how's that working out for us? The property sits on prime real estate and we lease it out to Chartwell. Is that true? Granted now is not the time to be selling any real estate (how's that 25 acre parcel doing at BB?) but we sure do have some of our so-called assets tied up don't we.

[1whocares]

I am new here. Therefore please forgive my thoughts for perhaps being somewhat simplistic.
I have always heard that when you are in a hole- first stop digging. Another piece of advice has been clean up your own mess before looking for help. If I am not mistaken, the All-Day Kidergarten costs $7M per year- I know the state is supposed to pay for alot of that cost but the state is NOT paying it's bills. Why on earth would 204 continue the ADK paying $7M (BTW recall 203 and nearly all other districts in the stae do NOT have ADK) when we are in such a dire financial situation that calls for cutting 145 teachers! It seems like common sense to return the 1/2 day kindergarten and save 75-80 teachers jobs. What am I missing? BTW IF the state somehow miraculously comes thru, restart ADK if you must.

[doctorwho]

Mar 16, 2010 19:04:07 GMT -6 1whocares said:

I am new here. Therefore please forgive my thoughts for perhaps being somewhat simplistic.
I have always heard that when you are in a hole- first stop digging. Another piece of advice has been clean up your own mess before looking for help. If I am not mistaken, the All-Day Kidergarten costs $7M per year- I know the state is supposed to pay for alot of that cost but the state is NOT paying it's bills. Why on earth would 204 continue the ADK paying $7M (BTW recall 203 and nearly all other districts in the stae do NOT have ADK) when we are in such a dire financial situation that calls for cutting 145 teachers! It seems like common sense to return the 1/2 day kindergarten and save 75-80 teachers jobs. What am I missing? BTW IF the state somehow miraculously comes thru, restart ADK if you must.

We welcome you here and appreciate your insight, and fwiw, it appears you are missing nothing. It's what we have said here all along. They knew the state was in a financial mess, yet they signed us up with the purpose of 'virtually' doubling K attendance from 1/2 to full day to get more 'free' money, since we've been hemorrhaging money at the MVHS school site. It's all about schemes and smoke and mirros and the house of cards is now coming down.

[EagleDad]

Mar 16, 2010 19:04:07 GMT -6 1whocares said:

I am new here. Therefore please forgive my thoughts for perhaps being somewhat simplistic.
I have always heard that when you are in a hole- first stop digging. Another piece of advice has been clean up your own mess before looking for help. If I am not mistaken, the All-Day Kidergarten costs $7M per year- I know the state is supposed to pay for alot of that cost but the state is NOT paying it's bills. Why on earth would 204 continue the ADK paying $7M (BTW recall 203 and nearly all other districts in the stae do NOT have ADK) when we are in such a dire financial situation that calls for cutting 145 teachers! It seems like common sense to return the 1/2 day kindergarten and save 75-80 teachers jobs. What am I missing? BTW IF the state somehow miraculously comes thru, restart ADK if you must.

1whocares, welcome, I like your chosen name. Don't let the locals turn you off, me included

You explanation is self-evident. It makes perfectly logical sense. I wish I could explain it myself, but I am baffled by many things this district does. I believe ADK should be stopped as one of the first measures.

I should also add I am not neutral on this as I have a son currently in ADK, placed there at duress of his mother who was basically forced into it (it was either that or ship him across the district every day). I am a fan of ADK myself (and felt my son was ready), but it is a luxury that must go under these circumstances, in my opinion.

[refbasics]

Mar 16, 2010 19:04:07 GMT -6 1whocares said:

I am new here. Therefore please forgive my thoughts for perhaps being somewhat simplistic.
I have always heard that when you are in a hole- first stop digging. Another piece of advice has been clean up your own mess before looking for help. If I am not mistaken, the All-Day Kidergarten costs $7M per year- I know the state is supposed to pay for alot of that cost but the state is NOT paying it's bills. Why on earth would 204 continue the ADK paying $7M (BTW recall 203 and nearly all other districts in the stae do NOT have ADK) when we are in such a dire financial situation that calls for cutting 145 teachers! It seems like common sense to return the 1/2 day kindergarten and save 75-80 teachers jobs. What am I missing? BTW IF the state somehow miraculously comes thru, restart ADK if you must.

----------------------------
welcome 1whocares... you will soon join the rest of us in befuddlement and bewilderment about the goings-ons in our district.

if you want to hit the ground running:


1. put all common sense ideas aside- common sense doesn't work in our district, or in education, in general

2. altho everyone wants to label education as a 'business'... it doesn't follow anything you know about business, contracts, or business law

3. the school board usually becomes co-opted into doing whatever the school district superintendent recommends

4. for an 'entity' of this size $270 million budget and many buildings- you would think there would be long range planning, etc but there hasn't had to be any until now... because the tax $$ flowed in, and the state $$ flowed in... and the district could always count on referenda being passed easily to increase the rate to fund the schools

why do these referenda pass? people are too busy to pay attention, the issues are complex(or are MADE to seem complex ), and our district is HUGE (29,000 students)... when a change has to be made, it's like trying to turn around an oil tanker.
---------------
you have a wealth of postings on this blog to get up-to-date... after you are done with that, feel free to delve into the 'pension chasm' in our state of illinois. Yes, that is affecting us mightily but you wouldn't guess it... even tho our school board president is a WHIZ in all things financial... just ask him.

i hope i have't scared you off!