Question about capacity

[warriorpride]

momof3 said:

The gold campuses are capacity restrained by the high schools. And why do you use 93% capacity at the gold campuses but over 100% capacity at the high schools? Really, at least use whole kids because we know .7 kids can't be in every classroom at the same time. HEY wait a minute! Why did CFO take down their crazy capacity "proof"? It was just there yesterday! Oh, so people couldn't see the crazy backup for the crazy numbers.

Their pages seem to get shuffled around. The crazy numbers are currently located here: www.voteno204.org/page3.html

Talk about building something on a "house of cards", they want to count 1,623 * 2 towards the HS capacity. HELLO! You can only put freshman in the freshman campus. And nobody is predicting 3200 in any single class.

[warriorpride]

kae said:

What is this Indian Plains HS? Is it another area or is it what the sun is calling Frontier Campus. According to the worksheet or CFO, Indian Plains HS has 200 or 600 seats depending on which number you believe.

Indian Plains is an alternative HS. The home page explains it: iphs.ipsd.org/index.asp . It's essentially a separate entity & should not be included in any capacity discussion.

[warriorpride]

kae said:

My understanding is that the Freshman campuses aren't anywhere near full. So, if 8400 is with the Freshman campuses, remember according to Mr. Crouse, we're more efficient and we're running at 93%, then looking at the figures:


1514 NVHS Gold Campus (93% of 1623)
3223 NVHS
1514 WVHS Gold Campus (93% of 1623)
3759 WVHS
560 Frontier (93% of 600)
=================
10,570 Total Students

Kae, the total HS optimal capacity number provided is 8400, which is 93% of max capacity (9000). I updated my previous post to show my guess at the breakdown per building.

[kae]

momof3 said:

The gold campuses are capacity restrained by the high schools. And why do you use 93% capacity at the gold campuses but over 100% capacity at the high schools? Really, at least use whole kids because we know .7 kids can't be in every classroom at the same time.

HEY wait a minute! Why did CFO take down their crazy capacity "proof"? It was just there yesterday! Oh, so people couldn't see the crazy backup for the crazy numbers.

If you look at the Construction Grant, the district used 3223 and 3759 for the high schools. I can only assume that these are 80% figures just as 688 is an 80% figure for Patterson's 850 grade school. I think Topher was the one that suggested that here ipsd204.proboards76.com/index.cgi?board=sb&action=display&thread=1140625417&page=2#1140633321

CFO didn't take it down. It's right here: www.voteno204.org/page3.html That page also has links to the room by room calculation for the High Schools as well as the instructions for filling out the form. The worksheet pages showing what I'm talking about are on the district website at www.ipsd.org/Uploads/news_10612_1.pdf

[cantretirehere]

What I find odd when I look at the construction work sheet is the size that is listed for the Gold campuses.

First, because the STR report says the Golds are 1623 total capacity with and with a untilization factor of 85% they calcuate a 1380 anticipated total functional capacity.

Second is because the Golds avail capacity is shown as being only 24.3 kids more than the middle schools that they were similar to and created out of! To top it off the adjusted available capacity of the Golds is now less than those middle schools!?!?!?!?!? They spent millions of dollars making those middle schools into Golds and didn't make those buildings any bigger?!?!?!?!?!? I WANT MY MONEY BACK!!!!!!!!!

[wvhsparent]

warriorpride said:

kae said:

My understanding is that the Freshman campuses aren't anywhere near full. So, if 8400 is with the Freshman campuses, remember according to Mr. Crouse, we're more efficient and we're running at 93%, then looking at the figures:


1514 NVHS Gold Campus (93% of 1623)
3223 NVHS
1514 WVHS Gold Campus (93% of 1623)
3759 WVHS
560 Frontier (93% of 600)
=================
10,570 Total Students

Kae, the total HS optimal capacity number provided is 8400, which is 93% of max capacity (9000). I updated my previous post to show my guess at the breakdown per building.

The only other problem I see with using these capacity number are even if the Golds could hold 1514 students....then next year they would go to the Green campi.......so after only 2 years of "capacity" freshman students...the green would have 3028 with just those 2 grades....that leaves only 195 seats available for the exsisting seniors....

Now as far a NVHS... I would not have as much a problem there because for practical purposes they are all on the same parcel. and movement beween buildings would be possible without crossing a busy intersection (Ogden and Eola).

so even if the gold campi could hold say 2000...they have to go somewhere afterwards......

[blankcheck]

Yep- certainly looks that way cantretirehere. I have asked about these worksheets but still have not received an answer. It would appear that both gold campuses are operating at 50% and high schools at 80%. Again, the STR report does not include hallways and cafeteria space. Regarding the seniors, almost all of my kids friends have early dismissal/late arrival. Again, I would be interested to know how many seniors opt for thi.

[admin]

First, because the STR report says the Golds are 1623 total capacity with and with a untilization factor of 85% they calcuate a 1380 anticipated total functional capacity.

Honestly, I wish this subject would really die until we get clearer defintions,

I want people reading this board to understand that 1623 is the number of students that could fit in the school if every single usuable space is used every single second of the school day. This includes 2 gyms, a balcony, computer labs,science labs, applied science labs, band room, choir room. The frosh center is not going to have 9 periods of band with a full class.

Now the rest of the "capacity" definition we have are not clear. Until we get these defintions, any talk of what this or that "capacity" means is SPECUALTION and not fact.

It would appear that both gold campuses are operating at 50% and high schools at 80%

Perfect example of making statistics to fit one's case.

[cantretirehere]

I need to write another letter to the board, I think.

The board sent a response to a letter I had written about how I came up with my high end figure. In their response was the phrase:

"If the referendum passes, the optimal capacity at our 3 high schools will be 9,180 students (10,200 “times” 90%). "

To which I sent another letter asking:

"If 90% of 10,200, or 88% of 10,400 (9180) is optimal capacity for the 3 High Schools does that mean 1) if/when we reach 10400 students then 100% of all space in the 3 high schools will be utilized and be considered overcrowded and 2) Is the district predicting that when/if any maturing does occur in the district, that it is unlikely that the total enrollment of HS will be unlikely to dip much below 9180?"


To which I recieved the reply:

"Really, once our high schools pass the optimal capacity (defined as roughly 90% of the structural/architectural capacity of the building), one could consider them to be overcrowded (essentially, we use the term optimal capacity, because beyond that point, we begin to experience increasing levels of negative educational consequences). Therefore, once we pass enrollment numbers of approximately 9,200 we will be moving beyond a point that is ideal."

Also the letter said that they did not expect the district to mature "anytime in the next 15-20 years".

And this is why I think I need to write another letter - unless someone on this board already knows the answer and can help me out. My question is:

Why, ITRP, is the district planning on an amount of space between 3 mains and 1 gold, being only able to OPTIMALLY house and school 9200 kids when they are projecting a sustained enrollment of around 10,400?

P.S. just in case anyone was wondering, the response I recieved was not from C.V.

[admin]

cantretirehere, thanks.



What we need now is what exactly does optimal capacity mean?

[cantretirehere]

I thought it was defined in the 2nd reply to my letters:

"(defined as roughly 90% of the structural/architectural capacity of the building)"

Maybe we need to ask: exactly what does structural/architectural capacity mean?

[blankcheck]

Did he not just say that being 90%?

[kae]

admin said:

cantretirehere, thanks.

What we need now is what exactly does optimal capacity mean?

I was thinking about all of the responses we've written and I got a big chuckle out of it. You have to admit that it's pretty comical. ;D

This particular question that we all have reminds me of the Clinton/Lewinsky scandal where they needed a definition of sexual relations.

What is our dilemma?

What is the definition of?

Building Capacity
Optimal Capacity
Available Capacity
Adjusted Available Capacity
Functional Capacity
Total Capacity

It makes me wonder if Indiana has the right idea and that School Corporations are the way to go.

Oh, I forgot these two:

structural capacity
architectural capacity

[kae]

admin said:

It would appear that both gold campuses are operating at 50% and high schools at 80%

Perfect example of making statistics to fit one's case.

be nice Topher.

[admin]

busted